Pretty much embie.

You'd have to be really rotten to be considered a son of perdition and not recieve any glory.

There are three Kingdoms

The Celestial Kingdom - D&C 76:54-70


The Terrestrial Kingdom - D&C 76:71-80



The Telestial Kingdom: D&C 76:81-89



Reference also 1 Cor 15:40-41

that is all

Revelation 20:1-14

"And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time."

The "angel" coming down out of heaven is Jesus who is often called: "the angel of the Lord" in the OT. Jesus came to destroy the devil's work (1 John 3:8)and he did that through the preaching of the gospel message.

The "chain" gives us a picture much like that of a beast or wild and Vicious dog who is alive and well because he is chained up. A vicious dog on a chain is still able to attack those who go within his reach and so also with Satan because the Bible says the devil is free to prowl around like a roaring lion looking for somebody to devour.(1 Peter 5:8) Yet he simply cannot harm those who are beyond his reach. Therefore the chain represents the original gospel. The chain(gospel)hinders the devils attempt to lead people astray into Hell. Those who believe in a restored gospel, a different gospel, or no gospel are those whom Satan can attack and harm or destroy.

The time Satan is "set free" represents "widespread" apostacy and unbelief in the gospel.

"1000": The number 10 in the Bible always represents "completeness" The cube of 1000 is 10
So 1000 represents a complete period of time and that time is the entire NT period. The Bible uses 1000 also in Psalm 90:4 and 2 Peter 3:8. Those passages speak of the timelessness of God. They very clearly show that when the Bible uses "1000 years" that number is most definately not to be taken literally as the view I am against in this thread supposes.

There are no passages in scripture that say the devil will be unable to prowl around devouring people prior to the judgement.

There will not be a 1000 year reign of Christ on earth as you are thinking because the bible clearly teaches his kingdom is NOT of this world. (John 18:36)

I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years. (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years.

Notice in the above passages that the Saints "came to life" and reigned with Christ for the 1000 years. And this "coming to life" is connected to the first resurrection.

The first ressurrection represents our physical death in which the soul goes to heaven. (these Saints died) The second ressurrection represents the time our bodies will be reunited with our souls on the last day at the judgment.

So those who were beheaded died and their souls went to heaven and they reigned with Christ from heaven for 1000 years. Those 1000 years not being literal nor were they reigning on earth. The passages clearly point out that the "souls" reigned with Christ. It doesn't say the body and soul reigned with Christ. If there were a literal reign of Christ on earth, clearly the believers who died would have a body and soul, not just a soul.

That would be my answer to your question.

"Is" can be a LOT different from "will be". IOW, I don't think "is" rules out change.

Joel, you started off pretty good then lost me quickly as you wound down to the end

Revelation 20:1-14

"And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time."

echo, are you saying Satan is not deceiving nations anymore and Christ is currently reigning?

And we are in the midst ofa "1000 year reign on earth"?

We have the Gospel of God's grace and that keeps the nations from being decieved. Yes Christ reign's right now through the gospel.

Yes, but not a literal 1000 years, 1000 is symbolic for the entire NT period.

this world does not sound smell or feel or look like or anything like Christ's reign. If it is He is a weak Christ.

You are saying New Testament till now and moving forward is the reign Christ as well???
Ya know , you can look around and tell Satan is not bound. He is everywhere on this earth , wreaking havoc. How can you reason NOw is Christs reign?

Was Christ weak when he was despised, beaten, rejected, crucified and put to death?

Yes, right up until the end of the world.

Christ reigns in our hearts through the gospel.

Jesus didn't say: "I WILL overcome the world". He said: "take heart, I HAVE overcome the world"

DO YOU BELIEVE IN THE "RAPTURE" AS IN 1 THESS 4:16 ?
BECAUSE Christ's COMING IS AFTER THIS AND SO IS THE 1000 YEAR REIGN OF CHRIST. ACCORDING TO REVELATION 20 THE 1000 YEAR PERIODS ARE LITERAL. arg , darn caps....
Not figurative.

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This [is] the first resurrection.

Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy [is] he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

First the rapture of the church , next the 7 tear tribulation, next the second coming of Christ with His Bride (the church) and then we reign together a 1000 years.

Also Christ certainly was not weak during crucifixion, but how that relates stumps me. Christ did not reign during His time on Earth. The Church began and Gods plan went forth, but it was far from reigning.

Secondly, you said "right up until the end of the world" - exactly when is that according to scripture.

Christ reigns in hearts , yes. But this is taking literal and making it figurative. Everything the Bible proclaims is His coming a second time to set up HIs Reign on Earth. IN power and majesty. To say His reign is taking place anbd has been since the NT church is somewhat ----uhhh---nuts? Was he reigning in the dark ages? was he reigning during the holocaust of His people, the jews? was he reigning opver EARTH when entire populations of people had never heard of Him? The answer is no. Reigning in our hearts yes, BUt our hearts and the Earth are never tied together in scripture.
Does WELS believe or adhere to the doctrine of the Blessed Hope? Christ coming for His church and taking us from this earth before He comes again?

JOhn 16:33
These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

This is not about reigning Echo. It is about the world beating down on Christians, but in His resurrection he overcame - it is done.
Right now Satan is the ruler of this world, the Bible proclaims it. We as Christians are in opposition to it. "Be in the world but not of it."
When the Devil offered to give Christ all the cities of the world, he could not have done this unless he owned them and Christ did not refute his ownership either.

2 corinthians 4 3-4
But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.


Hello?
What say ye to this?
Let me just say , i would love to believe we are in the reign of Christ but we just cannot be at this point in History. It inst Biblical accurate to say so.

Telestial? man that hurts when you get kicked there...just a little comic relief

echo, are you checking what the WELS would say ??? where did you go. I am genuinely interested in how your denomination has arrived at this doctrineing Nab

no body thought the telestial joke was funny...i thought it was just a little funny

Now that I've responded, she'll see the thread. maybe you'll get an answer.

Juss, I laughed (alot) at your joke...

(maybe that's why Allen questions my Christianity... ROFL! )

Joel, I have another question for you. Once your kingdom has been determined, is that it or can you eventually get to a higher level?

Nabster, first, what is your definition of the rapture?

Come on echo -
Thessalonians verses stated above. We shall all be "caught up in the sky" - you know where I stand.
What about 2 corinthians 4: 3-4?

There is progression within the glory of the each Kingdom, but there is not progression from glory to glory.

Judgment is final.

Nabster

Let's slow down. Otherwise we are giving each other too much info at once and nothing has a chance to sink in.

I believe this verse is refering to the rapture that happens at the end of the world.

What do you believe happens after the literal 1000 years has ended and the tribulation that follows the 1000 years?