Yes and no. Good Anwer?

I've always been taught and believe that a man's obligations are as follows:

First obligation is to God, second is to family, third is to self, and fourth is to church. Now obviously this is complicated because these are all interelated. If I treat my family poorly, my relationship with God suffers; if I don't take care of my mental state, then my family suffers; and so on.

If at all possible, meaning if your family can avoid abject poverty in any other way, I would consider it a sin to work on Sunday. We baptized a fella last week who was the manager of an Auto parts store, when he learned about how serious it is to keep the Sabbath, he quit his job. I was certainly impressed.

Now if the only job you can get, requires work on the Sabbath, and if you don't take the job, your family will starve, then work on Sunday.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Joel33:
Now if the only job you can get, requires work on the Sabbath, and if you don't take the job, your family will starve, then work on Sunday. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">well Joel I agree with you on this subject except for one thing.....the one quoted above...the bible says to obey the laws of your land unless it interferes with Gods laws....and also it might be a test of faith...when you are brought with that decision...because you have to realize that no matter what God will provide if you stay faithful to him

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Leviticus 25
18 " 'Follow my decrees and be careful to obey my laws, and you will live safely in the land. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Exodus 20
6But if you love me and obey my laws, I will be kind to your families for thousands of generations</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Leviticus 19
37and I command you to obey my laws</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Leviticus 26
3Faithfully obey my laws, </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">there are many more... any way what are your views on that Joel?

Agreed.

I just wanted to stop short of condemning a person's faith because they work on the Sabbath.

I do believe God would prefer that we obey all righteous laws. However, not all laws are righteous. For instance, back in the 1800's it was legal to shoot a Mormon in the state of Missouri. This law wasn't actually changed until the 1970's. I would call that an unrighteous law and I would resist it.

I do believe God will bless us if we obey his commandments, but the problem resides with us generally, in that we hope to set the conditions on how he blesses us. Maybe we give up that job on the Sabbath and he blesses us by increasing our humility, and not by helping us find another job, that can be kind of hard to swallow for alot of people.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I would call that an unrighteous law and I would resist it. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">absolutely ... no one has the right to take a mans life but that also goes back to where God says if you strike a man with iron or a stone and kill him then you must also be put to death...Gods law is do not murder...so even if its a law in mossouri its still against Gods law


as for the rest of your post i agree but I know that no matter what as long as i stay faithful to God and all his commandments that he will take care of me...i proved that with my testimony ...not even the police can stand against God

Leviticus 25
18 " 'Follow my decrees and be careful to obey my laws, and you will live safely in the land.

Working on the Sabbath is a requirement in many fields - medicine, police, fire, military, restaurants after church I don't think God meant for 30% of the people in the hospitals to die or become seriously injured becase the staff needed the day off. Same with our safety with the police, fire, military.

Besides, that is scripture from the Law, we are living under grace now.

well yeah but thats all understandable Big Al and please dont take offense because that never even crossed my mind but that kinda goes along with the story in the bible about if your ox is stuck in a ditch er sumthin you cant leave him there till monday...it needs to be done sunday....so the hospital and fire and police i think would be excused from this....what do yall think?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Besides, that is scripture from the Law, we are living under grace now.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">And as I've pointed out the standards Christ asks us to adhere to are far more difficult to keep up.

I suppose if he'd addressed this commandment in the Sermon on the Mount he would have said "It has been said of them of old "Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy." But behold, I say unto you, "Don't even think about breaking the Sabbath." "

I'm all good with necessary services working on the Sabbath. However, what my wife found when she was still working as a Nurse was that there were enough non-Christians willing to work on Sunday that she could trade with to get a Saturday that she almost never had to work on the Sabbath.

that is a good point Joel but not every non christian is willing to work on sunday because its usually there beer drinking bar b quing day off....well at least where I come from.
but if you have to work its understandable....

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Joel33:
Besides, that is scripture from the Law, we are living under grace now.... I say unto you, "Don't even think about breaking the Sabbath." " </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I think you said it your self bro. We are Living under grace now...and by his grace and mercy ...is what brought me through.

Actually, I didn't say all of that, Part of that was me quoting Allen.

I'm glad you brought this up though because it's led me to some other scriptures that I like and speak to some other points I've been trying to make.

In fact I kind of differ with Allen's interpretation. Surprise, surprise!!

I firmly believe that while we are saved by Grace, Christ did introduce a higher standard or higher law of obedience than that introduced by Moses in the 10 commandments. The evidence is in Matthew 5 during the sermon on the mount wherein Christ discusses many of the original 10 commandments and changes them from "Thou shalt not do such and such." to "Don't even think about such and such."

The law of Moses, is referred to as a schoolmaster. A schoolmaster prepares us for something more once we are out of school. The law of moses prepared us for the higher law of Jesus Christ, wherein according to our faith we will live our lives in a more exacting manner as outlined in Matthew 5. Our faith will be manifested in and evidenced by our works.

Galations 3:24-29

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">

not totally sure what thats supposed to mean bro. if you could ...would you please clarify your point a lil bit

Christ did not do away with the Law - he fulfilled it and instituted a higher law. A few pages back I posted a ton of verses from Matthew 5 to illustrate the differences between Christ's law and the Law of Moses - I'll sum up the major differences:

Moses: Don't commit adultery
Christ: Not only don't commit adultery, but don't even lust after a woman in your heart

Moses: Don't kill
Christ: Not only don't kill, but don't even get angry.

Christ takes the law that was revealed to Moses and expands it from dealing merely with our actions to dealing also with our thoughts and intent. A much higher standard.

I believe Christ has called us to live under a higher law, and that our faith in Christ should be manifested by our willingness to do so and evidenced by our actually doing so.

it makes since I just dont see what it has to do with any thing.....maybe i misread sumthing though...I'll go back and read over it....

I guess you could just say what Allen calls "living under grace," I call a "living under a higher law."

I think because Christ is so loving and compassionate, people are quick to forget that he still wants us to be obedient. That's why I guess I'd call it a "higher law" -- in order to remind folks that along with all that grace there is still a law, by which Christ expects us to abide.

makes since.....

whoa....I kept tha last word in this topic all weekend ....does that count as the last word ?