Is there a god? I think not...I wonder how long I will last on this board...how "open minded" you all are...I am truly the Devil's Advocate...will you hear me?



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Satan Lives...God Sucks

I am open minded to a lot of things. But the one thing I will believe from now until eternity is that THERE IS GOD. Not A god not some gods. The One true LIVING GOD. I will hear you out. Give me some evidence that there is no GOD. You say you are the devil's advocate. Well explain this to me. How can you work for him and not believe in God? Sir, EVEN SATAN believes in GOD.

Also, how can you say that God sucks if you don't believe in HIM?

And why would you want to be the advocate of one who seeks to steal kill and destroy you? His promises are sweet, but in the end they will be your destruction. Why not choose to be the advocate of your creator? The one who will give you everything you need and LOVE you because you are HIS child.

Good point...truly, I do not believe in god...or satan for that matter. I post "I love Satan" stuff all over my office...as somewhat of a joke...some are offended, some are not...I do it to kind of to prove nothing bad will happen to me...and nothing ever has (knock on brimstone). I do not mean to "belittle" your beliefs...many of my good friends are born again, go out and witness, etc...I just don't think there is a god...

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

How long will you be on tonight? Are you willing to hear ME out? I have to go home. I am at work right now, and my daughter is waiting for me...Are you gonna be around for a while?

but would you tell me this before I go...What evidence have you that there is no God?

Unfortunately, no...I am hitting the sack...it is 2:30 am here...sorry...I will check tomorrow and reply/reflect as necessary...thanks...I enjoy a civil, thought provoking discussion...

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

And why are you so intent on proving that nothing will happen to you? What do you think that there is someone watching waitning to strike us all down? We killed Jesus after spitting in His face and mocking Him and jeering at Him...If God were gonna strike us down, don't ya think He wouldve done it then?

Okay, well you have a wonderful night. I will pray for you. He does love you even if you don't want to admit that He is there.

Evidence...first, prove he exists...second, why all the famine, death, hate, etc? Third...science is a factor, although many can reconcile the differences there...third, I lost a good buddy on a parachute jump about 2 years ago...left a loving wife, and 6 month old daughter...his job was to save lives and he was killed while training...I regulary holler out "I love satan" prior to exiting an aircraft...why did god make us like we are to hate, mame, rape, murder, etc? If he supposedly created us in his image...why would you worship a hate monger and murderer?

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. Adam was made in His image. It was God's intent for man to commune with Him and love Him as our creator. But Satan is a liar--and a good one at that. And he was able to decieve Adam and Eve into believing that thier God was a liar. Knowledge is what he promised them. Death is what he gave them. Since they sinned, they lost the bond that they had with God. A whole world of sin has since followed. We are all born sinners. Only through Jesus Christ are we made new. Once we recieve His forgivness, then we begin, once more to be in His image. Born again, a new creation. If one is truely Christ-like, he does not do the things that you speak of. Those things are of Satan. God gave us free will. Some of us choose to love Him. Some of us choose not to. Those who choose not to are open targets and succeptible to believe the lies that Satan tells. If he can convince you that God does not exist, then he doesn't really care whether or not you believe in him. In fact, he would rather you believe that he doesn't exist, so that you will not be aware that anyone is lying to you.

My last post this early am: I believe that religion is a cop out for people that don't want to take responsibility for their lives and actions...I do not believe in god, ergo, I can't "admit" he exists...there are too many religions that force others to bend to their beliefs and standards...the crusades were a good example...many religions "save" people by forcing them to convert...if that is god's work, shove it. I'll leave you with my favorite quote:

It matters not how straight the gait, how charged with punishments the scroll...I am the master of my ship, I am the captain of my soul.

I'll be back tomorrow...

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

Then have a good night. I will chat with you tomorrow. ps. I don't want to convert you! I just want you to understand that there is so much of the picture that you are not seeing. There IS GOD. And He loves you whether you admit that He is there or not. You can't stop Him from loving you. You can curse Him, you can deny Him, You can do as you are doing now and choose not to believe in Him. But why would you want to deny the fact that there is someone who loves you so much that all He wants is to be with you?

I am going home. Good night.

Okay, it is now 2:30 am here. You are an hour ahead of me. I hope you had a good night's rest by the time you read this. I will be up most of the night praying for you. That is a promise. You see, this is how I see it. You want evidence. But faith is the evidence of things unseen. If you can look around you at the earth and all that is in it and tell me how we got here without help, then go ahead. I would rather believe that I was put here by a loving creator than to believe that I evolved from slime and a monkey. I take full responsibility for every action that I take, every thought that I have. I choose to give the pilot seat to the only one who can steer me in the right direction. You are right. At this point in your life, YOU are steering your own ship. And I pity to say that you are steering it in the wrong direction. If you are not for God, then you are against Him. I don't say that out of meaness, but out of LOVE. And you see, THAT, my friend, is what it means to be IN HIS IMAGE. I am not some flaky new age peaceloving treehugging hippie. I believe that the battle of spirital warfare rages, and that I am a soldier of Christ. My heart hurts for you right now, because you are so bitter. I do not think that you signed on here with the intention of making me believe that there is no God. I think that you want someone to prove to you that God exists. You are looking for something and you even know what it is. But you want proof. Well, sad to say that I cannot show you a sign or perform a miracle for you. I am only human. I choose to believe that God exists. I know Him because I have felt Him, and I have seen the evidence of HIM in my life. I now have a personal relationship with Him. If you would only have the faith the size of a mustard seed, you would be surprised what God could do with it. He could change your life. You can argue with me all day about how a loving God could cause such terrible things to happen. Well let me tell you this. He is not the one who causes these things. It is through Satan's deception that we sin, and if you really want to talk about taking responsibility for actions, it is OUR SIN that gets us into the messes that we get in. But Jesus already paid the debt for our sin. That doesn't mean that we no longer have to take responsibility for our actions. Just the opposite. It means that we must confess, "God, I have sinned. I have fallen short of your glory. But I beleive that through your son Jesus' death, my sins have been washed away. Please forgive me." That doen't mean that we can sin over and over and over with the intention of asking to be forgiven so that we don't burn in HELL. It just means that we then strive to be more like Him, and do what we were created to do. And that is to LOVE HIM and give HIM the glory for everything that we do. We choose to die to ourselves and let HIM in the pilot seat. We choose to love everyone as He has loved us. We choose to be more accountable for our actions. We choose LIFE. For the wages of sin is death. But if our sins can be forgiven, then we may have eternal life through Jesus Christ our SAVIOR. I ask you now: If you think that Christianity is a cop out for those who don't want to be held accountable, and yet you do not believe in God, then WHO HOLDS YOU ACCOUTNTABLE? You? That hardly seems fair...You would not dare pass harsh judgement on yourself. You just do what you wish and do not answer to anyone. Is that right? Well then which is more of a cop out? Again, I say this out of love and not judgement. I love your soul, and I love my Jesus, and that is why I will pray for you and "discuss" with you until you decide that you do not want to hear any thing more that I have to say. He loves you. Like it or not. He's there. Denying it wont change it. Deny the existance of the sun. Go ahead. Say that the sun does not exist. And the look out your window. Is there not evidence that the sun exists? If you see none, then you are blind. Did your words change anything? Now. Say out loud that God doesn't exist. Look out your window. Is there NO evidence that He exists? If you see none, then you are blind. Did your words change anything? No. He is there. And He loves you.

Hi! Boy, Devil's Advocate, you picked the right person to discuss with...or should I say that God picked the right person for you to discuss with. Foreverchanged is a shining example of God's existance! And, I'm just here giving my $.02. Okay, like foeverchanged said, I can't give you so called "proof" that God exists, but take this "testimony" from a witness for God's Advocate.

I'm 20 and last year, I was diagnosed with Hodgkins Lymphoma, cancer of the lymph nodes. But by God's healing hand and the skillful hands of medical tech's I am here in radical medical remission. One year of extensive treatement. I lost my beautiful dark hair when I was put on steroids. I was in the hospital among other things...surgery. But I can tell you WITHOUT FLINCHING, I never blamed God. Because He healed me. Talk to my Oncologist...my recovery was exceptional. He's a "Christain" so the only thing you would get out of him was it was totally God. But nothing else can explain my abnormal reaction to such harsh treatemtnt...nearly no side effects. In the fall, I will start back to college in perfect health. I, like foreverchanged, am going to devote today to a fast and prayer for you. I pitty you. What hope do you have? What if you wake up tomorrow and you have cancer? Where is your hope? In yourself? You are only human...ther's only so much you can do. In doctors? They are also limited humans. All this is in love...we will not kick you or boot you...we want to talk to you...God bless

~Alanna

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"...It's all about you, all about you Jesus..."

Firstly... just want to say thank you for joining us DA. This should be a good discussion as long as it doesn't wind down into name calling, shrill screaming, blah, blah, blah, etc, etc,... it's always good for people to dig down and see what they really believe...

I really can't answer you better than forever has already.. she has done beautifully. Stick around tho... this discussion is good for both of us... and I too, pray for your soul...



Most people who have studied "the crusades" know that religion had very little to do with what went on at that time. It was much more to do with money, slaves, land, and power. The "religious" aspect was a veil for their ambitions... as has been most "holy wars".. God has been blamed for a lot of stuff He had nothing to do with...



That was prolly Henley's most famous poem... He really was having a miserable life @ that time while battling tuberculosis and losing his leg, I can almost see him shaking his fist at God while writing that poem... it doesn't change the facts tho:

"Art thou in truth? Then what of Him
Who bought thee with His blood?
Who plunged into devouring seas
And snatched thee from the flood,

Who bore for all our fallen race
What none but Him could bear--
That God who died that man might live
And endless glory share.

Of what avail thy vaunted strength
Apart from His vast might?
Pray that His light may pierce the gloom
That thou mayest see aright.

Men are as bubbles on the wave,
As leaves upon the tree,
Thou, captain of thy soul! Forsooth,
Who gave that place to thee?

Free will is thine- free agency,
To wield for right or wrong;
But thou must answer unto Him
To whom all souls belong.

Bend to the dust that "head unbowed,"
Small part of life's great whole,
And see in Him and Him alone,
The captain of thy soul."

- "The Soul's Captain" by Orson F. Whitney



I look forward to it...

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Allen

The air and Jesus:

The air, we can't see it but we need it to live. We see the effects of the air (wind) but we can't actually see the air.

Jesus, we may not be able to phsically able to see Him, but we NEED HIM to bring us back to our loving and caring DADDY in HEAVEN. We see the affects He has on us and others.

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If you decide not decide, then you have decided. JESUS or nothing

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something i read:

"the captain of a ship on a dark night saw faint lights in the distance. He told his signalman to send the message: ""change your direction 10 degrees south.""

Immediately he received the response: ""change your course 10 degrees north.""

The proud captain was angry that he was being challenged, so he sent a further message: ""change your course 10 degrees
south. This is the captain speaking!""

He received the response: ""change your direction 10 degrees north. I'm Seaman Third Class Jones.""

The captain, thinking he would terrify this insubodinate sailor, wired a third message: ""change your direction 10 degrees south. I'm a battleship.""

The final reply came: ""change your course 10 degrees north. I'm a lighthouse."""


signed me
the nobody

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Wonderful points...and a great discussion...I will assure you that I will not resort to name calling...I respect your beliefs. Frankly, nothing you can say or do will change my mind...THAT is my belief...I DO NOT, nor will I EVER believe in a "god"...you can pray for my soul all you want. I navigate life as I see fit, and live/die by the decisions I make...no one helps me. I am not bitter, sad, or confused...I live a full and productive life, married to a wonderful woman with a lovely dog named Waldo...I have risked my life jumping out of an airplane into the middle of the pacific ocean to save the crew of a Taiwanese fishing vessel...I chose the path that led me to that (and other) moments...I am not fufilling any destiny...I am not simply following a pre-determined path. I believe that once I die that is it...the end, poof...nothing more...no afterlife, no heaven, no hell...simply, the end...ergo, I make the most of my life...living every moment, striving to reach my goals...and helping others along the way...not because of god...but because I CHOOSE to...if I chose to murder, it would not be because of satan...it would be simply my choice. That is what I believe...you believe differently and pray for me...I don't mind that a bit...it may make you feel better, but I assure you...it does NOTHING for me. If I woke up with cancer tomorrow, I would set my MIND to beating it. I applaud you NRefining for your courage and good health...you thank god...if it were me, I would simply chalk it up to mind power and go on...I simply have a different outlook and live my life by my rules...no one elses...you all live your life by a so called "gods" rules...fine for you, not for me. Some questions:

1. With all the different religions in the world...who is right? Allah? Jesus? Mohammad? Budda?...if there is only one god...why has he confused over half the world's population?

2. How do you reconcile the commandment "thou shalt not kill" with eating meat, wars (we have many chaplains, fathers, etc. in the military), killing plants if you are a vegitarian, etc.?

3. Are dinasaurs mentioned in the bible? Impeccable evidence proves they existed...Scientific evidence proves we evolved from (as someone put it) slime and monkeys. Explain.

I will post this and see if anyone is on...if not, I shall return...thank you all for a stimulating discussion!



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Satan Lives...God Sucks

I'm on but I'm working. Be back in a while.

I can't stay on...be back tomorrow...

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

Then have a good night.

Hello everybody, I'm Nobody. I just happen to have heard a few possible answers to some questions, and wonder how well they would stand up in this discussion.

1. With all the different religions in the world...who is right? Allah? Jesus? Mohammad? Budda?...if there is only one god...why has he confused over half the world's population?

People are confused because we don't know everything, not because anybody is messing with our minds.
Even if there is only one god, that doesn't mean there is only one power in the world. I have the power to cause confusion by telling lies, that doesn't mean God is doing it. The powers that confuse and lie word mischief and claim to be "gods" may be called Satan or other names, but nobody here believes that God is the only one working in this world.

2. How do you reconcile the commandment "thou shalt not kill" with eating meat, wars (we have many chaplains, fathers, etc. in the military), killing plants if you are a vegitarian, etc.?

Laws can be explained and modified by other laws. That's why we have ammendments to the constitution. There are many laws on our books that can't be taken out of context and applied to every situation generically. Why shouldn't it be the same for the laws of Israel? They were given other laws that explained and modified that one.

3. Are dinasaurs mentioned in the bible? Impeccable evidence proves they existed...Scientific evidence proves we evolved from (as someone put it)slime and monkeys. Explain.

There is a reference in the book of Job to something called "Leviathon" that may or may not be a dinosaur. What difference does it make? The Bible doesn't talk about everything that ever lived.
Science can only prove what it can observe. Things that happened so long ago can never be proven. Therefor science has not and never will prove beyond doubt the THEORY of Evolution. There is a lot of evidence that a lot of scientists interpret as sufficient. Others do not interpret it that way. It cannot be proven. Nor is science able to prove or disprove anything that has to do with "spirit", which includes gods of most types.

There is only one truth. I will spend my life searching for it. I hope one of you will help me in my search. Thank you.

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I would be happy to help you if I can...I don't know nearly all the answers. But I know the truth.

Thank you forever, Forever.
I don't want to take over this topic, I still want to hear both sides of this one. But I also have questions for the christian folk about "sin"
Should we start a new topic for that and continue this one too? I'm not sure how this works yet...

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Anyway, I'm off to bed tonight. I'll be poking around at random. Advocate happened to catch my attention, I'll keep up with this one. I'm not necessarily on one side or the other yet, I just want to stir the anthill and see what comes to the top. Good night for now.

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Nobody, you are welcome. I can start a topic for you if you wish. Ask all the questions you would like. As I said before, I don't know all the answers. Lord only knows that I still have SO much to learn. But I will be praying for you too. And I will answer any questions that I can, and I'm sure that my buddies will do the same.

Jim, I have so much that I want to say to you. I just don't have the energy right now. I am tired. I do want to say that praying for you does not make me feel better if it does nothing for you. And that is why I will continue to pray that it will. All in God's time. Would you answer something for me? Was there EVER a time in your life when you believed in God? Even counting when you were young. Please be honest. Good night.

There was NEVER a time where I believed in a god...my parents did...I did not...they were upset, tried to explain their beliefs to me, but in the end, accepted me as I was. I have been to church in my very young days, forced by my parents. I left home at 17. It always seems that there are many, many caveats and explanations when dealing with religion...laws that modify commandments, there seems to be excuse after excuse to explaing things in the bible...and ultimately in all comes down to faith...without faith, it all goes to feces.
How can a virgin have a baby? Also...regarding communion...why are catholics all cannibals? Yes, cannibals...when they "eat of my body" and "drink of my blood" are they not eating the body of christ...this makes them cannibals in my book???

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

hey jim...gonna respond to that later...gotta go to church. im late. Are you going this morning? (oh....I guess not. Well, it was a thought, no?) Have a good day. I'll be back.

Cool... please do start me a room so I can ask questions. Anyone is invited, of course, I just don't want to take over someone else' topic. Especially so interesting a topic..

Yes, there seem to be a lot of things that just have to be taken on faith in any area of life, not just religion. Science spends a lot of time making up excuses for their theories too. What is an excuse for one person sounds like a good reason to another. Somebody had to explain math to me, that doesn't mean they were making excuses, I just didn't understand. There are many religions I don't understand, I will give any explanation a fair hearing. There are freaks in every religion, and many freaks that don't have a religion. You have to judge everything on it's own merit. I'm not Catholic because no Catholic has ever been able to answer my questions to my satisfaction. I'm not going to blame anyone else for their faults, or excuse them. Science can't answer all my questions either, so I'm going to keep looking.

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Nobody...I allready started you a topic. Because everyone's someone.

Jim, if this were a perfect world wihtout sin there would be no problem following all of the commandments. However, as we all know, the world is far from perfect. The commandments were a general set of rules to guide our lives by. However, like all rules, at one time or another, they will be broken. God is not unreasonable. He knew that instances would arise in which it is necessary to kill. He even lets us know in His word that "there is a time to kill and a time to heal". Almost every rule has an ammendment. I'm sure that you've ammended rules in your life at one time or another. Just for instance, say that you made it a rule for yourself never to jump out of a plane when it is over the water because You had been given strict instructions when you learned how to parachute NEVER to jump out when you were over the water. Although you had been given opportunity since then to do so with the assurance that no harm would come to you , you still refused. (follow me for arguements sake) But then, one day the plane was in trouble. It was going to crash into a mountain and you knew it. The only way to save yourself was to bail out...and you were over the water. As soon as the water ends, the mountain begins....logically--don't argue, because I'm sure you probly would--You'd parachute over the water....right? You broke the strict instructions that you were given with the possibility of punishment by death even because you have never jumped over the water and so you don't quite know what to do when you get there...But you had to break your rule and give yourself at least a small chance to survive. That is what I mean by ammendments to rules. Now about animals...God tells us that we have dominion over animals. They have no souls. THey were placed here for our food...clothing...pets...(here Waldo). ANd your comment about communion seems slightly irrelevant to me, as they are not actually eating FLESH AND BLOOD, but the representation of flesh and blood. They do so in rememberance of the death of our Savior as you shout "ilovesatan" in remebrance of your friend when you exit a plane. It doesn't make them cannibals any more than your little ritual makes you a Satanic Worshiper.
I am not going to pretend that I understand your point of view. I would be a liar if I said that I did. In fact, it disturbs me. "For the fool has said in his heart 'there is no god'". I have believed in God since I can remember. There was one point in my life where I was angry with Him. That was the bleakest time in my life. And of course, doubts arise...But He has always proven Himself. And then again, I had a tiny bit of faith. That's what I meant in my earliear post about the mustard seed...to be cont. (I have to post this so that my comp wont kick me off for staying dormat too long..)

Really, I suspect that, although you will deny it, you really do believe in God or else you would have been able to sufficiently prove to me that there is no such thing. I think that you are just very angry with Him to the point that you wish He didn't exist. Don't feel bad. I wouldn't admit it either! Not even to myself. It is much easier to pretend that there is no God then to own up to my anger...(all goes back to that cop-out thing you mentioned earlier...)

It seems to me as if we are at somewhat of a stalemate. You have failed to give me sufficient evidence that God does not exist just as I have failed to prove that He exists. But I have at least tried to answer your questions. Now it's your turn. I'm gonna post this and then type some stuff that I want you to explain rationally for me. Put your thinkin' cap on...I'm postin....

Hola mi amigos and amigas,

I want to say hi to DA and to Nobody. I will not claim to speak for everybody, but I feel that there are a lot of those that will agree with me when I say I trully welcome both of ya'll (excuse my southeast Tx's vocab) to the forum. Let me share a little about who I am and what I believe because that is all I have to offer you in my life.

I was baptised baptist and then attended an Episcopal jr high. I later attended a catholic highschool where for educational purposes we learned about all religions acroos the globe. I say that to say this... I too used to feel as you do (as do many people across the globe) --I was religioned out.

I had one of my best friends die when I was a senior in highschool. His name was Ramon. Ramon lived a life worthy to be called a Christian. He was mentally challanged and grew up in a family that did not have a lot of money. But, anytime you talked to Ramon he was never complaining about what he didn't have he would always talk about that we he did have. He went to school full time, played football, supported his church, and still rode his bike to work after all of that to make what little money he could to help support his family.

The day after our last senior eat-out he was driving his dad's car home when he had an anurism (blood clot in the brain) that erupted and killed him instantly. When his mom called to see if he was at my house I knew something was wrong because he never just stayed out and didn't call his mom. He would never want her to worry. When I found him hunched over his steering wheel on the side of the road I remember thinking that it wasn't really happening.

I began to cuss God and all that I knew because I couldn't understand how someone like Ramon could die and someone like me was allowed to live. I too turned to myself for answers and began relying on me to determine my own destiny. People came to me and began to bash me with their religion and I would nod half heartedly as if I understood just to get them to shut up.

Then one day out of the blue a friends mom and I were talking about something totally unrelated to religion and she shared with me a story about a relative that she had that had the same passion for life as did Ramon. She talked of the determination and love that her mom had for her to find a true relationship with Jesus. And I remember thinking "I really don't know this Jesus that she is taling about as I claimed to."

I knew of him and all the statistics that had been taught to me throughout the years, but I really didn't know Him intimately. I decided that if I was a man controlling my own life then I would wipe the slate clean of what everyone else said and find out if I believed IN HIM or not. I began to read the Bible with an open mind trying to answer such questions as "did He really feed 5000 with what He had or was it some kind of trick that He used to gain glory and fame?" Did He really walk on water or was it the salt level that kept Him afloat? Thing like that.

What I found was that the Christ that I was reading about, unlike a lot of the christians that I knew, was not out for publicity...He was just about love. He trully cared for those whom He healed and He travelled preaching a message of forgiveness and love that was based on no other thing than wanting ME to realize that which Ramon was showing me everyday...It's not what I don't have it is what I have that counts.

It was then that I met God!!

I wish now I could tell you that I began to live a perfect life and everything made sense, but I didn't. I took the knowlege that I had and burried it under all the pain that I felt until once again I had forgotten how much Christ loved me. You see all the knowledge in the world wouldn't help me because I lacked the faith to walk in it.

We try to figure out those things which are confusing to us by going back to the stuff that feels comfortable. But it is this comfort zone that covers up the fact that we can't explain everything that happens in life. I couldn't explain Ramon's dealth but I do know that if he felt that strongly about Jesus (with everyting in his life) that I owe it to myself to quit hiding behind my easy answer of Religion Sucks and really find out Why God loves me as much as He does. You see what I know now is it is not about how many times I sing, or how many "hail Mary's" I say or wether or not some say this of some say that, It is about the God that I KNOW!!

I do know God is real because He shows Himself in the things which I cannot explain. Those things I can are just gravy.

I believe that everyones "walk" is their own and we should remember that. I just pray that if I can ever be a blessing to you or help you along the path you are taking you would ask me.

And when you are ready (again in your time) to wipe your slate clean and talk, I would love to share with you the Jesus that I know.

innerdawg

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Forgive me for any typos... Explain this:

I know your basic Bible stories from Sunday School and the verses like John 3:16 that most people know...(just background info). But I never really thought it was important to read God's word, ergo I wasn't familiar with much else except for what I had learned in basic Sunday School...Having said that, I will go on to my story.

When I actually gave my life over to God, I still didn't understand the importance of His word. One night, I missed service (at Stand318 actually). That night, for some reason, I was miserably depressed. I prayed that God would speak to me. Why couldn't I hear His voice? I wanted a word straight from HIM. And I suddenly felt compelled to pick up my Bible. I opened it up, and the page it fell on was where I read. The book of Hosea. I had never read Hosea before, and am not ashamed to say that after I read it I felt like I had wasted my time. I didn't understand what it had to do with me. Then, the next day, one of the guys from Stand called to tell me that they had missed seeing me there. I asked him what they talked about. He said that the speaker had read out of the book of HOSEA...the same story I had read. He then went on to relate it to our everyday lives. Okay...coincidence? Yeah...okay...if it had stopped there.

A couple months later...I was reading my Bible a couple times a week. I was studying the book of John. But I was struggling with some unresolved sin. Sorta. I had resolved it with God, but not with myself. I felt like no one was there to comfort me because I was such a bad person, no one would love me for the mistakes I had made. Again, I cried out to God to speak a word of encouragement to me. Once more, I felt compelled to read in my Bible. I had been reading in John as I said before, but it seems as if I had accidentaly lost my place because when I went to the page marked by the bookmark, I was in Isaiah. I was going to go back to John, but a word on the page caught my eye. Isaiah 40:1 "Comfort, oh yes, comfort my people Says our God. Speak comfort to Jerusalem and cry out to her that her warfare is ended. Her iniquity is pardoned. For she has recieved from the Lord's hand double for all her sins." Coincidence again? Okay....next

About a month or so later I was struggling really hard with the fact that I'm a single mother. The father of my child is voilent, and so I gave him the boot. But I still was feeling a little rejected and lonely. Along with that burden it seemed that I had lost touch with God. Normally when I pray, I can feel His presence. In this instance, I could not. I knew He was there, but...I just couldn't feel Him. I felt so far from Him. I went to Stand and the speaker was great and I cried and cried..not really because the speaker was good but because I still felt such despair. I kneeled at the altar asking God why He had withdrawn from me. What had I done? He brought some things to my attention, and I repented. But I still couldn't feel the comfort of His presence. I finally figured that I wasn't accomplishing anything, so I stood up. I had been kneeling for so long that my feet were numb. I stood up, lost my balance, and fell right there in front of everyone. Swollen eyes, red faced, prolly had snot all over my nose...hair wet with tears. I was embarassed. But I couldn't get up and leave. I just sat there and cried. "God..why? Dont you love me?" I thought. Then thesame guy that called me the time before came up to me and embraced me and all he said was "He loves you". And I cried and cried all the way home and when I got home I gave up. I told God as much. I QUIT. I tried to sleep. I could not. I asked God to speak to me. I could not hear Him. And AGAIN...I felt that I needed to read. Remembering what happened before, I didn't hesitate. I went to open my Bible, but it was allready opened to Isaiah 54. "Do not fear, for you will not be ashamed. Neither will you be disgraced. You will forget the shame of your youth and will not remember the reproach of your widowhood anymore. For your Maker is your husband. The Lord of Hosts is His name. And your redeemer is the Holy one of Israel. He is called God of the whole earth. For the Lord has called you like a woman forsaken grieved in spirit. Like a youthful wife you were refused says your God. For a mere moment I have forsaken you. But with great mercies I have gathered you. With a little wrath I held my face from you for a moment. But with everlasting kindness I will have mercy on you. For this is like the waters of Noah to me. For I have sworn that the waters of Noah would no longer cover the earth. So have I sworn that I would not be angry or rebuke you. For the mountains shall part and the hills be removed, but my kindness shall not depart from you." You can't say that's not exactly what I needed to hear. Coincidence? How did my Bible get opened to Isaih again? I was in Psalms earlier that day...

The next time it happened was a week ago. I was contemplating whether or not to leave the job that I am currently at. I prayed for direction. I just wanted to do His will....All that I could think was, I wonder if God has ever called someone from a good job to a more important one. And the name Hezekiah came to mind. I looked for the book of Hezekiah. There is no such book??? So I looked the name up in the index, and found the story of a man named Hezekiah in 2Kings who had a good job working for the king. But one day, a messenger came to him and told him of a crisis in another land. Feeling compelled by God to go to the other land, Hezekiah prayed about it, and then told the King that he was going to go. It's a great story, but I wont go into great detail for lack of time. But once more, It was exactly what I needed to read. I still don't know whether I will leave or not, but God has guided me this far....and I trust Him.
ps...if you think I'm making any of this up for your benifit, you can look in "intro&how to" and find my serious introduction. In there, I tell the story about the Hosea incident. And the story about Isaih 54 can be found in yeeeeha under WHEW! and the job situation is in fuse box under MY JOB...only I haven't updated it yet...I been kinda busy the past couple days.... Almost done.

I am no Bible Scholar, Jim....nor am I a woman of great knowledge as anyone who knows me could tell you. I am 21 years old and I completly gave my life to God October of last year. I can't preach a sermon or quote alot of scripture from memory. I have doubts sometimes about certain things, but I am as sure as the sun rises that God exists. And He is teaching me. He knows the answers when I do not...and he's not stingy with them...they are all right there.

Although I know that you can dismiss the Bible as some made up book of fairy tales by some wacko with a sick sense of humor, but how do you explain the evidence that they have found to support the Bible? i.e. pieces of the ark...stuff like that. You have explinations, right? To me they are all excuses. Lame excuses that you use to justify the fact that your heart is hard as stone. I admire you for your work, and I love you as a person. But I cannot respect your opinion on this one.

You say that if you were healed of cancer you would chalk it up to willpower or something? You must have some awful lot of confidence in yoursef! Why does anyone get sick then? I believe that God allows some people to pass on when it is their time and he heals them when it is not their time. All According to HIS plan. But if it is as you say, then why can't everyone heal themselves? Why can people recover from cancer and not aids? And you still havent answered my other question:

If we hold ourselves accountable to GOD for our sins and you hold yourself accountable to no one....which is more of a cop out???
ps...I'm not a cannibal.

Hey Michelle, Nobody is in Gibberish. He has asked some questions. i don't think he knows that you started a site.

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Amber the almight coffee maker

This is a great disscusion. To DA: no, i don't belive catholics are cannibales. I belive what that scripture was refering to was when he was abou to die, his body broken. Drink from my blood, was his blood spilled for our sins. You're right , there is nothing we can say to change your heart, only the Holy Spirit can do it, and that is what we pray for. A question, how can you hate something you don't believe in? You sound alot like my father, his parents went to church faithfully, but when he was 12 they gave him a choice, and he stopped going. Now he's has supposedly a great life, healthy family, good job, money, ect., but, what will he do if all that failed him, what will he belive in when when he can't do or control anything him self. He'll finnaly come to grips, stop being so complacent and hard headed,give up control of his life. So in ending, I pray the Holy Spirit warms and opens your heart and mind and soul. Remember, never say never, your not ultamitly in control.


To nobody: leviathan is a powerful demon from way back that is sent to destroy ministries and things that build up God's kingdom. Some things in the bible are not to be taken extremly literal.Remeber back in that day no one could hardly read so the bible and it's values where told in laymans terms and to get the point across.


God is working,
stevo

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To nobody: to even know about laviathan you must have some religous background, because most christains don't even know what it is. Please share more. Later i might also give my background when time alows, but until then, bu bye

stevo

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To answer that question...you say "sin" I do not believe in "sins"...ergo, if I do something wrong, my conscience and the law shall hold me accountable...depending on the severity of what I did...if it is against the law, I will be punished...if it is not, but against my personal code of conduct, then the only accountability or punishment will be how heavy it weighs on my conscience...simple. I live my life how I choose...not by someone elses rules (except in the context of public law and basic rules of acceptable behavior). I DO NOT consider this a "cop out"...it is what I believe. You should respect what I believe...you should say to yourself,"I have tried to explain...he dosen't see it my way, I will let it be"...I know that is what will happen, but it seems alot of religious fanatics/zeolots are not happy unless EVERYONE in the WORLD see things their way. They feel it is their duty to "spread the word" regardless of other people's rights and beliefs...this is where religion goes too far...what right does ANYONE have to force their beliefs on ME?? Muslims preach that america is the "great satan"...they encourage their fanatical followers to sacrifice themselves in the name of Allah and do great damage to us...with promises of being saved and winding up in their version of heaven (paradise)...is this right? You as a christian will disagree with that approach and the Muslim religion...yet who is right or wrong...it all comes down to beliefs...EVERYONE has the right to believe what they want...it is written in the constitution (freedom of religion...or lack there-of)...the religious zeolots forget that. If you have any other specific questions, list them please...I will answer them...you long (and, I might add, eloquent) writings/answers are great, but many times if there is a question hidden (or not) within those words, I miss them. Take care and I look forward to more stimulating discussion.

BTW: Have you considered adding the "AOL hack" to your board? I wouldn't mind an AOL instant messenger discussion now and again...more real time that way...

Thanks,

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

okay, maybe i worded that wrong. i am not a zealot. I am not trying to force my beliefs on you.. YOU ASKED....and why do you care if i respect you or not? And if you say that chrisianity is a cop out, is that not disrespectful in a way?
muhamid buda crishna....(i cant spell) all of them have one thing in common....and one thing that sets them apart from our GOD. THEY ARE DEAD.

I did not mean to infer YOU were a zeolot, nor do I care if you respect ME...EVERYONE should respect everyone's elses beliefs...additionally, I BELIEVE christianity is a cop out...you don't, I respect that...that is all I ask...mutual respect. I don't believe you are a zeolot...I simply meant that there are zeolots out there...that force their beliefs on others...you are not doing that...for which I am most appreciative.

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Satan Lives...God Sucks

so according to what code of conduct should everyone respect everyone's beliefs?

And by saying GOD SUCKS, are you not disrespectin my GOD?

Another question...if as few words as possible what is the "stand318" and this ubiquitous "world domination" thing...sounds rather dictatorial to me...

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Satan Lives...God Sucks